Trading123
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Honesty
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Quality
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Cost
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Support
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Verified Trades
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User Experience
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Summary
Here we go again. Yet another Ninja Trader Brokerage/Ecosystem trading vendor making massive claims of trading profits and absolutely zero proof. Since 2004, Patrick Moore has been peddling all manner of trading ridiculousness. Including live trading rooms with NO REPORTED LOSSES and most recently, a ‘trading system’ that supposedly earns $40,000 to $50,000 each and every month, on full autopilot.
Just “set it and forget it,” Ron Popeil would be proud of this $3,995 trading system that supposedly earns massive profits, with maybe one loss per year.
A ridiculous charlatan that is being promoted by Ninja Trader as a Certified Educational Provider.
When questioned about his product, and addressing the legitimate concerns of paying customers, the owner of Trading123 proceeded to describe his customers as “Idiots, fools, morons and pathetic.”
Thanks for reading today’s review of Trading123.Net
Trading123.net is an automated, futures trading systems vendor that is currently being promoted by the Ninja Trader Brokerage/Ninja Trader Ecosystem. The owner of Trading123 is Patrick Moore, and he claims that his trading system, “Is more accurate that any human trader out there.”
The cost of the Trading123 automated trading system is $3,995 and offered exclusively on the Ninja Trader trading platform. In order to use the Trading123 automated trading system, a person must also purchase a license for Ninja Trader, at a one-time cost of $999.
Using Archive.org, we can see that Trading123 has been selling various trading products and services since 2004.
Supposed Performance Claims of Trading123.Net
Patrick Moore is making some very aggressive claims regarding the supposed profitability of his automated trading system. For instance, a thorough viewing of the archived web pages reveals several years of supposed trading results–with never a losing month. In fact, during the entire year of supposed trading–never a losing day. Pretty amazing, if true.
The Trading123.net website claims the following supposed performance metrics as factual, and 100% verifiable:
- “CL Autotrader averages $500 a day trading 2 contracts of CL past 2 years”
- “As of 2/12/2016 Autotrader averages $1600 a day trading 2 contracts of CL”
- “CL record one-day trading 2 contracts $5270 in profits on 2/12/16”
- “As of 2/12/16 AutoTrader averages $2000 a day trading 3 contracts of NQ”
- “NQ record one day of trading 2 contracts $4174 on 1/21/16”
- “YM averages $1200 a day trading 3 contracts with Autotrader”
- “YM record one day of trading 3 contracts $7800 on 12/14/15”
Patrick also maintains a YouTube channel at the following address:
The YouTube channel appears to be quite active. Recorded videos began appearing in early 2007. As you can probably already imagine, the videos are screen recordings of supposedly winning day trades. Video after video, the profits seem to roll off the screen in a never ending cascade of glorious profits. In fact, we could not find a single video of a losing trade.
In addition to the YouTube channel of never-ending trading profits, there is also a Twitter feed that can be found at the following address:
TradingSchools.Org began live tracking the Twitter feed on May 1, 2017. We diligently recorded every single “real” trade that Patrick Moore posted on the live Twitter feed. We recorded the following:
- May 2017: $48,830 total profit with only a single losing trade of $280.
- June 1 – June 12: $23,495 with no losing trades.
A truly amazing 99% win rate. If true.
Complaints and Inquires
Since 2015, TradingSchools.Org has received a total of 9 inquiries to review Patrick Moore of Trading123. Of these 9 inquiries, 3 people emailed Trading Schools directly, complaining of “fantasy trades” and the inability of the trading system to execute and match the trades being marketed on the Twitter feed.
The number one complaint is that the trading system is always able to enter and exit trades with no delay or hesitation, on simulated mode. But once the trading system is introduced to a live trading environment, then the trading system is not able to enter and exit trades with relative ease, or comparatively to simulated mode.
This type of complaint is the number one complaint that we hear about trading vendors offering trading systems and trading rooms through the Ninja Trader Ecosystem. That a simulated trading environment is never able to translate onto a real, live trading account.
Speaking with Patrick Moore of Trading123
During the month of May 2017, TradingSchools.Org began a series of outgoing emails in hopes of writing a review and addressing issues that purchasers had described.
All of our official TradingSchools.Org emails were ignored.
However, we sent various emails using an alias. In which we described ourselves and “new” and “looking to learn.” These benign and non-threatening emails were promptly answered. It seems that if a person appears to be a ‘newbie’, then Patrick is more than willing to correspond in hopes of selling his trading system.
On June 12, 2017, I was finally able to get Patrick on the telephone. I politely introduced myself from TradingSchools.Org, (recorded) and that I would be writing a review. Immediately, he became defensive and highly agitated.
I plainly questioned him about his supposed trading performance. Like a caged tiger that had been poked by a stick, he came out angry and fighting. I could feel the heat traveling across the phone line. He said, “who in the hell do you think you are, asking me for my trading performance?” And, “I don’t need to prove anything to anybody.”
How dare you question my trading performance?
When asked if his performance was real and verifiable, he said: “my trades are all live, and real.” When asked if he could provide a redacted account statements, he replied: “You can go fuck yourself.”
When asked to comment about performance discrepancies from purchasers, he replied: “It’s not my fault they are idiots and morons.”
Once Patrick began to describe his paying customers as “fools, idiots, morons, and pathetic”, then I knew I was dealing with a borderline psychopath. He then proceeds to state that NinjaTrader had fully verified his trading performance and that NinjaTrader would never allow a con-artist to market a product on the NinjaTrader Ecosystem.
Finally, he concludes our conversation with a veiled threat that he used to a be a private investigator and that he can find anyone.
Wrapping Things Up
Another day and yet another NinjaTrader promoted trading educator and trading system provider that turns out to be a charlatan. A phony, a fake, and a fraud. A person with no verifiable track record, and little respect for the legitimate concerns of ordinary investors.
This guy is a pathetic, ridiculous con artist being enabled and promoted by NinjaTrader. Shame on Ninja Trader for allowing this to happen.
Thanks for reading. Would love to know your opinion.
Patrick NEVER shows who he is red flag 1 .. NEVER shows proof red flag 2 .. he can lose 50k then make 2k and only show the wins (Like he does) he only goes for newbies too please be careful this guy been scamming for many years
trading 123 is a huge FRAUD it doesnt work he posts NO losses this is a SCAM STAY AWAY
The system is quite simple. It is designed to automatically enter into a trend change and run with it. It cannot just be turned on and let go. He provides an extensive write-up (map) for CL and NQ that is predicated on certain key times to turn it on, bottoming tails or patterns and lots of other factors that can enter into your plan or not. The problem is that they work only when they work, and when they do not you have to absorb multiple 14 plus tick stops on the CL for example and if it “Zebra Stripes” or chops, that can add up so darn fast it can be overwhelming. Now, his trades on Twitter are magic for sure, he shows profits about 98% of the time, and if you let it run long enough it may or should catch a trend, but there is no actual set of rules that you can use for metrics or consistent measurement. So if you want to do a Mark Douglas/Trading in the Zone/ metric on 20 trades, you can’t. His trades are more “feeling” that it will move, or post market pattern identification. He uses a lot of other indicators that he does not share, but if you communicate long enough you may get salt and peppered to you. Like any strategy or automated trading system, it takes a lot of capital and experience to test this out and at 12 to 14 tick stops and the erratic nature of markets to repeat patterns, but never on time or exactly the same way this system can be very frustrating. Using or viewing the Twitter can freak you out because if he is getting those results, which would make him rich and why would anybody sell this system if they can win 98% of the time like clockwork and it looks so pretty; the renko charts look beautiful. Also, because it is not “rule based” but really “feeling” based and relies on somewhat of an infinite number of variables that can be employed to foresee the probability of a trend, which of course is the magic tonic that most systems try to sell, you need to be able to test of for a few months and that option is not available. No rules means no metrics and no edge that can truly be defined. You can try to develop your own set of parameters and rules, but quite frankly you will never ever get close to what the Twitter charts look like, and that gets frustrating. He will not spend the time or provide the real time trading/ live trading or full chart disclosure you need to maybe mimic or pickup some of the formulas that work, he gives you a roadmap, but it is not tradable without a lot of pain, loss and testing and the live trading is really really scary stuff when the market chops and your AutoTrader is flipping back and forth. Still, he certainly shows what every wannabe trader wants to get, long winning runs on a long winning trend … etc etc etc. buyer beware.
The system is quite simple. It is designed to automatically enter into a trend change and run with it. It cannot just be turned on and let go. He provides an extensive road map for CL and NQ that is predicated on certain key times to turn it on, bottoming tails or patterns. The problem is that they work only when they work, and when they do not you have to absorb 14 plus tick stops on the CL for example and if it “Zebra Stripes” or chops, that can add up so darn fast it can be overwhelming. Now, his trades on Twitter are magic for sure, he shows profits about 98% of the time, and if you let it run long enough it may or should catch a trend, but there is no actual set of rules that you can use for metrics or consistent measurement. So if you want to do a Mark Douglas/Trading in the Zone/ metric on 20 trades, you can’t. His trades are more “feeling” that it will move, or post market pattern identification. He uses a lot of other indicators that he does not share, but if you communicate long enough you may get salt and peppered to you. Like any strategy or automated trading system, it takes a lot of capital and experience to test this out and at 12 to 14 ticks stops and the erratic nature of markets to repeat patterns, but never on time or exactly the same way this system can be very frustrating.
After listening to his youtube channel it sure sounds like the same scammer from the old XMA trader and Bounce trader. Bad dude…if it is the same guy. He starts the sites then packs up and leaves only to start another one. New name, new product but no support!
This guy is a total scam…got me for 4k before i found out about this review…the system works great when your paper trading but as soon as you hit live account your orders never fill..i got off ninja trader completely and would never use their platform ever again…to bad there’s no way to take these scum down…!!
It never posted the link ..
I Put this out there , because Ninja is the only Platform that allows you to disguise a SIM account. Every other platform clearly shows when you are in SIM. Obvious Ninja allows this to enable their scummy eco-system.
https://youtu.be/udp-pJpBGZo
Good link and video showing how easy it is to mock up the DOM and charttrader to look just like a “live” account of a shamshow. If that isn’t blatant enough a conflict of interest of Ninja where every scammy vendor can mock up a shamshow and claim to be live in videos with sim or market replay mode. That’s what shadowtraders got fined for, claiming pass of sim trading as “live” like just because it’s in “real time” on a sim account it’s “live” trading. This 123 vendor seems like ahole just woken up from his dream coasting on the monthly churn income fee of clients who lambasts as morons when it’s more like the case his blackbox ninja strategy probably has some rough lousy ninjascript coding. Generic blackbox ninja strategy somehow still gaining traction through lack of reviewing. Ninja backtesting is notoriously removed from reality and the sham vendors probably never fudge in the slippage factor to optimize the p/l graph. Forward testing is often far worse than the backtest and even replay I’d noticed the videos also show a form of renko. These renko bars, featureless strategies and can be practically plagiarized from compromised forums and modded up then sold ridiculously for thousands. Renko bars are notorious for their overlapping and high natural slippage of entries and exits not to mention often recurring whip-sawing. The raging sham vendor shows video spots when the price action is relatively smooth and noiseless on the renko, actually not that common. Anyways avoid, and remember Sachs and many other snake-oilers are hustling similar worthless ninja “autotraders”.
What an excellent video.
So much heart went into that video. The most difficult thing is putting others before ourselves. Making a personal decision to not sacrifice our souls for a few extra bucks.
Having the grit to stay on the right path. Guys like Kevin Davey have figured it out, how to actually make money the right way. And Kevin sells courses and books and the rest of the trading BS. But he can do it with a clear conscience.
Oh, and I might add…you don’t even need to have a great track record to sell trading products! My lord, Jason at B12 hasn’t made any money in a year, and he sells outrageous amounts of membership subscriptions.
Nothing wrong with selling a trading product. Just be honest about your warts.
This rare video reinforces what many suspect about ninja. Probably he read tradingschools and more are realizing the traction of coming out and the tide of calling out the scumbags has turned without letting the shills have the overwhelming voice on the web anymore. Many retail owners of NT who have done their own fiddling about with modding indicators and using ninjascript already know about these chameleon features. Just found this other video of his where he goes over tradingschools:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsb7qi3b7z4&feature=youtu.be&t=50s
Thinkorswim is basically impossible now to hide the papertrading mode when showing the whole window. I remember when it used to be before they fixed it, and Jason Carter, SanJose options and other option “gurus” tried to pass off the sim result screenshots as ‘real’ million dollar accounts.
“When asked if his performance was real and verifiable, he said: “my trades are all live, and real.”
When are you going to get one of the supposed regulators to address how the hell they allow this con artist to make statements like this and not be in jail. I will not be convinced the regulators are doing jack shit, until Ninja and their cesspool is closed and top execs are thrown into jail along with Stock twit execs, Lying Dean Handley and all these TR scammers. Seriously how hard is it to show this guy never traded using his ATS and that the ATS never performed as he claimed?
BTW his statement calling his customers fools, I remember Wade Cook make the same comments about his customers as he sold one nonsense method after another depending on what was hot at the time. In fact I remember any time a new bubble was forming thinking Wade Cook should be out with a new seminar soon right at the bubble peak telling you how to make a fortune.
http://www.fool.com/specials/1999/sp990422wadecook01.htm
http://isolditonebay.blogspot.com/2007/01/wade-cook.html
Yes when will there be a broad sweep of these sociopath bottom feeders. OK the regulators really do care, blah blah blah. They can throw a dart at any trading website and find an ongoing criminal enterprise. Hey start with Ninja Trader that would eliminate how many dirt bags. The more I read these reviews the more I am left in disbelief , anger and hatred for these losers. A regulator with some ##### must be out there with a desire to make sweeping changes in a industry that relies on deception to thrive.
Given the amount of bullshit that they continue to shamelessly promote, I’m starting to think that NinjaTrader must share Patrick’s view that retail traders are “fools, idiots, morons”.
They must be secretly laughing at everyone who opens a new account with them… laughing all the way to the bank.
I find it outrageous that a huge company like Ninja Trader would “wink and nod” to this sort of behavior. The Ninja Trader Ecosystem is a cesspool.
Just going to keep the pressure on. Keep exposing. Keep leaking the truth. Keep highlighting the conflict of interest.
This guy’s videos never post a loss, ever. The world’s most profitable trader and he wants to sell it to you for a meager fee. He trades every contract with a profit, in every market environment. You would think maybe one time the market spiked against him and took out his stop. Nope, not this guy. He just trades like a god without any draw downs. They are going to teach courses on this one in all of our universities for years to come.