MT Predictor

MT Predictor
  • Honesty
  • Quality
  • Cost
  • Support
  • Verified Trades
  • User Experience
1.8

Summary

MT Predictor is yet another software/indicator suite built upon the assumption that Elliot Waves and Fibonacci patterns can be used to predict financial markets. The MT Predictor live trading room would be the perfect venue to prove that the software actually works. However, the live trading room is nothing more than a combination of sales infomercial and well selected chart analysis. No live, real time performance summary of the trading room. No track record of positive trading results for either the software developer or the software sales person. No statistical summary of the indicator suite, only rudimentary "It worked here, and it worked there" analysis. A positive review is awaiting-if the developer or sales staff can show a verifiable profit. Until then, avoid.

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User Rating 3.25 (8 votes)
Comments Rating 0 (0 reviews)
Pros: Good sales presentation. Well developed and mature front end software application.
Cons: No track record of positive performance. Developer and sales person pushing the software cannot verify positive trading history. Live trading room is of little value. Underlying concept of software is highly ambiguous, esoteric, and open to many degrees of individual interpretation.

Thanks for reading today’s review of MT Predictor

What is MT Predictor? MT Predictor is quite simply an indicator suite and trade set-up scanner. The foundation of the product is based upon the underlying assumption that Elliot Waves and Fibonacci patterns display a predictive quality. The predictive quality, or “trading edge” can then be displayed using either the stand alone version (MTPredictor) or the indicators can be imported into Ninja Trader.

The cost of the stand alone version of MTPredictor is $2,495. There are no refunds. However, there is a 15 day trial period in which to evaluate the product. In addition to the one time fee of $3,495 for the software, you must also find a market data solution, which costs and additional layer of costs. The company currently recommends either IQFeed, BarChart, eSignal, or Metastock. Data fee’s range as low at only a few dollars for end of day data, to upwards of several hundreds of dollars for real time data.

MTPredictor indicators can also be imported into Ninja Trader at a one time cost of $2,495 per station. Once again, separate data fee’s can apply. However, the main disadvantage of Ninja Trader is that a person is now restricted to only Ninja Trader Brokerage.

MT Predictor Live Trading Room

MT Predictor does offer an accompanying, live trading room that is moderated by John Matteson. The live trading room operates Mon, Weds, and Friday from 10:30 AM EST to 11:30 AM EST. However, you will not find any live trading. Nor a trading DOM present on the screen, or a visual of a live trading account. There is no track record of any trades called inside of the trading room. The trading room is more of an hour long infomercial on how well the indicators worked on several, well selected charts.

Do Elliot Waves and Fibonacci Patterns actually work?

In the past two years, TradingSchools.Org has written about a multitude of companies that offer trading software based upon the esoteric concepts of Elliot Waves and Fibonacci. Some of thesetrump-golden-ratio-fibonacci companies include Back To The Future Trading, Profitunity, FX Groundwords, Indicator Warehouse, Nexgen Software, etc. None of these companies have been able to provide a statistically significant trading edge. None of these companies has gotten a positive review.

Is it really so difficult to get a positive review? Actually, it is quite easy. A software vendor can easily obtain a positive review by showing that either the software developers or an actual purchaser of the product has been able to consistently earn a positive income. Ultimately, this is all that matters. And with all of the mentioned vendors, none can provide even a morsel of evidence that profits are being made.

Consider this…MT Predictor has been selling trading software for the past 16 years, and with such a large time window, it is unreasonable to ask that the developer proffer some sort of proof of concept? Is is unreasonable to ask the trading room moderator to produce a redacted account statement?

Unfortunately, neither the developers of the software (Steve Griffiths), nor the salesperson (John Matteson) were able to produce a brokerage statement that verifies if they have been able to product a profit.

Wrapping Things Up

In my opinion, one of the most frustrating aspects of reviewing trading software and live trading rooms is that these companies expect consumers to pay thousand of dollars in up front fee’s, and hundreds of hours learning a trading concept. Yet, are unwilling to trade the product themselves. They expect consumers to simply trust, and hope that it works. Unfortunitely, the vast majority fail, because the concepts that are taught are built upon a ruinous and unproven foundation.

I would love to draft a new review of MT Predictor software. Would love to write nice things about Steve and Mark, but I need some sort of proof that this stuff actually works. And I cannot think of a good reason why they will not release trading records. Can you?

Thanks for reading. Don’t forget to leave a comment below.

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Winter Is Coming
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Winter Is Coming
I knew it. Emmett I am pleased that the veil has finally been lifted on these guys. They don’t trade their own software. They don’t trade live. Basically they don’t trade at all. However, they do expect people to stump up the cost of their software, backed by nothing! I call these types of vendors, fiat vendors. The only reason there is a monetary value on their software is because they put it there. Otherwise it is backed by nothing at all. @swatfa – your response is totally flawed. If a vendor is stating “MTPredictor VS Buy nails the Low… Read more »
Simon Watfa
Guest
Simon Watfa
@Winter is coming, i never commented on their marketing. I’m aware that almost every vendor whether saint or sinner promises everything under the sun -They’re in the software selling business – almost every software provider that i’ve come across practices the same tactics. The whole business is shady, but that doesn’t mean what they’re selling is snake oil. If you’re able to replicate their software that’s great, perhaps selling it might be profitable… Furthermore as a developer you should know more than anyone here that there is no magic formula, so i find some irony in your excitement for having… Read more »
Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
Fair comments. Excitement may be the wrong word, but elation yes. My reason is fairly simple. I have been there, done that and got the t-shirt when it comes to getting my trading “education”. I have fallen for the best looking software, best sales pitches and I have painted the walls in many trading rooms. I have even given evidence to the CFTC on a vendor, whom subsequently got charged with fraud. It took me a while to realise that there is only one person whom can teach me to trade and that is me. These vendors know exactly how… Read more »
rtchoke
Guest
To me, indicators are simply confirmation of what price is doing. Indicators don’t make you money, only price does that. In my trading, I use 1 indicator but it is simply to confirm my entry or to indicate that price may be at one of my targets and I should take profit. I also use multiple time frames and the price on the higher time frame there serves as an “indicator” for the lower time frame (ie, big fish eat the little fish). Just my 2 cents. I would suggest to anyone beginning trading to start by looking at a… Read more »
System trader
Guest
System trader

As a system trader (and a mathematician and an engineer), I can tell you categorically: there is NO edge on fibonacci I wish was that easy! Don’t waste your time. Thanks for exposing these vendors. Fibs are a curiosity for after the fact trading, you will always find a level that ‘more or less’ fit the past. If you dispute this, show me your data.

Simon Watfa
Guest
Simon Watfa

i trade with fibonacci indicators everyday. Live trades. I have very clear plotted lines for fibonacci and i trade them as support/resistance as the candlestick approaches them.

Does it work all the time? no, but a conservative 60-65% of the time. +/- 2 or 3 ticks. It remarkable how many times i’ve seen price come to a stop around these zones.

i don’t mind sharing redacted real account statements or screenshots, not blowing hot air here.

It’s worth noting that i dont use fibonacci exclusively, but i do use it as a very key part of my overall strategy

System trader
Guest
System trader
The ‘supposed’ edge is due to existing support/resistance levels and other factors (volume profile traders at level, other fib traders, etc…). Fibs alone will not get you anywhere. Therefore, if Fibs will not help you why use them? Try to remove them and you will see that your overall results will not be affected at all if you know how to trade price action and order flow (if not improved!) Why? Because statistically the edge is marginal if any. This small edge will not put you beyond your commissions + slippage. Ask any system trader. As a system trader that… Read more »
sunil
Guest

its not just fibs….your whole accumulated experience and skills are in play when you make your decisions…BUT may appears as its only the fibs.

t0030tr
Guest

Nothing works all the time, but I think your quick dismissal of Fibonacci based on your background is short sighted. Fibs do work, I see them work all the time.

sunil
Guest

In my opinion, fibs just provide you a refernce level to develop some perspective…when you have none.and thats it

avgdwner
Guest

Good points. I’ve constantly seen examples of other vendors who don’t use their own software, much less even trade, and don’t even trade sim if they can get away with calling out trades trickery. Sometimes they put the effort in marketing or “trader news” such as Skyes or Marcello. Or it may just be one of several sites or businesses such as barrybburns.

Tamiaya
Guest
I have the MTPredictor Software for Ninjatrader. If you want to manually plot Motive or Corrective Waves, the software will do a decent job of that. However, if you use the software generated entries and exits …. the win percentage of trades averaged out to be 28% with a a Reward to Risk of 1.9. Deducting for commissions, the system was basically break even. Adding 1 or 2 filters did increase the profit factor somewhat, but not large enough with their system to stomach having to sit through large system pullbacks and corrections. MTPredictor remains to this day in my… Read more »
Tamiaya
Guest

In addition, with such a low win rate, you can have a dozen losers in a row. Not many people can tolerate that mentally for the reward of breaking even.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming

I will almost bet a 13/48 Moving Average Crossover strategy is more profitable.

Lucky7
Guest

IMO an indicator is just a tool. It alone will not make you profitable. You can have the best canvas, brushes, colors in the world but if you’re a crappy artist you will not get good results. Give those same tools to Michelangelo and you will have a masterpiece.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
Yes you are right. But in this case if MTPredictor is “predicting” (via automatic setups) the trades for you, both the crappy traders and the good traders should be executing them in exactly the same way on the same ‘canvas’ using the same ‘paint’, ‘brushes’ and ‘colors’. If the good traders skip the losing trades that MTPredictor continuously spits out, then something else is in play on a discretionary basis unrelated to the software, which then makes the software questionable at best. The software may “work” and look great, and they may post videos on YouTube stating how great their… Read more »
Stray Dog
Guest

Agreed. If the logic of Winter is Coming’s post doesn’t convince you then read Tamiaya post above. The only sensible conclusion, based on the evidence, is that the software is breakeven at best and hell on your nerves if you have the stomach to ride out the drawn downs.

swatfa
Guest
Respectfully, i think you may be guilty of over-simplifying something as complex as trading. Does fibonacci work in trading? Certainly, i’ve used software from nexgen as well as others and it clearly plots (let’s say a modest 70% of the time) correct support and resistance lines. Do elliot waves work in trading? Certainly, again 65-70% of the time you will see the same behaviour in the fifth wave etc. Do indicators that help plot elliot waves or fibonacci trading provide you with an edge? Yes, absolutely, without a shadow of a doubt. But this is where things start to go… Read more »
Pekelo
Guest

You are saying it is money management what makes money for those traders and not the software itself. Guess what, you could be profitable with my magic 8 ball if you use good money management. It is the exit what determines the outcome not the entry….

Simon Watfa
Guest
Simon Watfa

No that’s not at all what im saying. I clearly stated that things like fibonacci and elliot waves provided a good edge, what i implied was that using them stand-alone was not effective, meaning if someone purchased these indicators and was expecting to make consistent profit they would be foolish.

In short, a good strategy + good money management tends to work. Your magic 8 ball is hardly a good strategy.

Also, your point about the exit determining the outcome is correct….hence –> money management (stop loss, profit limit for the day, max number of trades etc)

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming

Simon – you are missing our point.

MTPredictor advertise this “It does not matter what markets you trade, MTPredictor is there for you finding trades and helping you control your trading risk.”

Should they also state then “Oh and by the way on their own our indicators are quite rubbish. You need to have a 3 year background in TA, a course by Tony Caldero on Elliott Wave and some additional confirmation indicators from Futures.io so you can filter out the bad trades our system gives and let the winning trades run”.

Almost spring here
Guest
Almost spring here

I use MTP on daily Forex charts.Taking a random chart, EUR/USD, had 4 system generated setups since January 2016. One not taken , against trend, three winners, with a total of 16.2 R.
You can fill in the R what is acceptable to you and I challenge to to prove to me that this MTP system is a rip of.

Ben Maltz
Guest
Are you using the same MT Predictor that I am? I find MT Predictor quite useful in identifying trades and setting the proper position size (based on your account size and the risk ion a specific trade setup). I makes trading Fibonacci techniques quite easy. I also do NOT understand most of the grades you’ve given to the software and its publisher. I have had very quite and effective responses whenever I’ve submitted a question (which has been several dozen times). I CERTAINLY find them to be honest in all their dealings with me. So, I think you need to… Read more »
Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming

So Ben, put this to bed for everybody on here.

Do you use MTPredictor software and trade live? Yes or no?
Are you consistently profitable using MTPredictor? Yes or no?
Would you be willing to post a month of verifiable trades that can be matched to MTPredictor trades that are triggered. Yes or no?

I know this is a little work, but unless you can prove it, the folk on here will just assume you are a shill.

MrUnderwater
Guest
MrUnderwater
I own MTP and have used it in the past for live account trading (roughly 2 years I struggled with it) but like any trading tool it needs you to keep the faith and discipline and master that b4 committing cash to it. I lost money with it, by the boat load. It has many problems as a methodology for day trading….especially if you have to make a living. Be aware that the method will yield a win rate of 35-40% even though it will have a positive expectancy overall. This means large drawdowns and big wins to make up… Read more »
Stray Dog
Guest

Well said Winter. The people posting a defense of MT Predictor should be able to back this up with proof. So far requests to do this have been met with silence.

kenneth
Guest

The developer of MTP mailed his customers yesterday asking to put positive reviews and comments on this site and on big mikes forum, so we will never know if people were willing to defend it if not being asked directly or its simply people think the developer is a nice guy and help him out.

dtchurn
Guest

It’s the “denial of buyer remorse” syndrome. They bank on the psychology that bilked clients overpaid for their software and have to justify that it was a good purchase. They contribute to the monthly churn of new buyers then there is a “kool-aid” phase where the denial could last a month or less up to a year or more. Like someone buying a hyundai and having to drive it before finally ditching it.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
Exactly. MTPredictor have been pumping their software for years now and getting away with it. They are choking on their own kool aid because they truly believe it works. The newbie trader comes along and they start believing it too. Heck, the newbie will even defend the vendor for a while, until they being to realise the software is next to useless. It ends up on the scrap heap until they can finally publically reveal how truly rubbish the software is. Step in TS for them to be able to do that. Bravo. Out of every trader I know, not… Read more »
David
Guest

I remember somoene posted they already had trading room which miserably failed, MT Predictor “expert” just couldn’ do it publicly. No need to challenge them, it’s all clear already.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming

@ David

Enough said then!

Still, if I was a vendor and I really had belief in my own product, I would take up this challenge just to prove everybody wrong.

We all know the MTPredictor software is a turd. And you can’t polish a turd.

Rob B
Guest

I thought the Hyundai genesis was getting good review over the Mustang.

dtchurn
Guest

The quality of Ford cars hasn’t exactly been the best in it’s history. Hyundai experimenters move on after a kool-aid phase.

dtchurn
Guest

Well to backtrack,comparing MTP to a hyundai isn’t the best analogy seeing that most all signalling software sold to retailers aren’t even consistent to begin with. The main point is denial or delayed buyer remorse often results in little or no actual reviews or feedback to warn others.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
@ dtchurn Agreed, partly because of shear embarrassment. The trader is either embarrassed that they bought the damn thing in the first place and don’t want to appear a loser and admit it. Or of course they are embarrassed they can’t make it work as well as the developers say it “should” or “will” work. I can honestly say I don’t know how the developers sleep at night. Is it because a newbie just dumped them $2,350? They are at it again with their latest video “MTPredictor Holy Grail sell on NQ catches the sharp fall” This trade was not… Read more »
Graham
Guest
In the same way as trading in general. probably only about 5% of MTP purchasers make money with it. It is full of ambiguities and contradictions and must be put in the ‘subjective/discretionary’ system category. Up to now it has been very difficult to assess whether it is profitable based on the system generated signals, due partly to the rather useless STF trend indicator which sometimes users were told they should have ignored and other times they were told they should have respected. This indicator is now being replaced by an indicator based on the major swings to determine trend… Read more »
MrUnderwter
Guest
MrUnderwter
As per my post above. Most wanna be traders are not ready for losing streaks of up to 10 or 12. My largest with MTP was 13 in a row. I then made a rule with my own trading plan that said I would stop a 3 losses in a row. And that just had the effect of making me miss the odd larger R winner. It became futile to trade it. When I asked Steve G for help I got zero help. Nothing. De nada. He just said he would not be drawn to comment on individual trades. But… Read more »
Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
@MrUnderwater Thank you for sharing your experience. At the end of the day, MTPredictor is a business. And like all businesses they need to make money. Their business model is to fleece as much out of the struggling trader as they possibly can before that trader realizes the software is near on useless. What better way to keep traders on their payroll but with upgrades and ‘must have’ add on modules. Unfortunately, the average trader is currently on their 12th losing trade and will do anything to turn their trading around and of course buy any upgrade they offer. Just… Read more »
MrUnderwter
Guest
MrUnderwter
I was thinking of the positives for MTP. They are…. If you use EW analysis MTP gives a simplified approach and the waves do not change (unlike say Advanced GET). And that’s about it. As a side remark…..Some years back, I actually spoke with another MTP user who I managed to contact through their old forum which is now defunct. He told me that Steve Griffiths told him personally that he blew out a number of his own accounts so he stopped trading altogether. Note – This was after I offered SG any price to go sit with the master… Read more »
Tamiaya
Guest
When looking at a trading system, a measure of comparison commonly used is Profit Factor. 2 systems with the same profit factor are not equal. For example, System 1 has a 80% win rate and a reward of only 1/2 the risk, and a Profit Factor of 2.0 System 2 has a win rate of 40% and a reward of 3 times the risk, and also has a Profit Factor of 2.0 However, with System 2, you have a 13.5% probability of losing 11 trades in a row. And what if you are trading 2 similar systems that give a… Read more »
rtchoke
Guest
Tamiaya makes a really good point. You have to imagine yourself losing 11 trades in a row. And how much will each trade cost you? How much in the hole will you be before the next profitable trade? Will you still take the next trade. I know a lot of professional traders including a hedge fund manager who manages traders. Each trader has to define his maximum drawdown before he will be funded. If his losses exceed his drawdown parameters, he’s cut off. Do you think any of them would accept 11 or more losing trades in a row and… Read more »
dtchurn
Guest
I’ll just add what everyone wise to these junk indicators already know. MTPredictor is a piece of junk indicator set that seemed to have been an alternative to AdvancedGET in those early year when expensive elliot wave software seemed to be the fad among the earlier duped generation of newb retailers. Over the years, they continued to keep it a black box mystique about it despite no reports of anyone ever becoming successful using it. As long as there are still newcomers to the retail market, some may still get caught up in it if they’re not wise to the… Read more »
majormongo
Guest
xxx
Guest

I never buy forex software. If it really making profit .,, they will keep it never sale it Lol

Dinas
Guest

Guess you didn’t do your homework on this one. I did find some data here:
http://www.mtpredictor.us/software/performance/
I have been in the trading room for a while and John does trade his account live when there is a valid setup which for him is usually the gap trades. You can tell it is live and a real money account because he uses their trade module which shows if it is a sim account or live, real money account and he trades right through the chart which is nice.

kenneth
Guest

So the room usually trades a gap trade, which is not actually a signal created by the software, but something the room operator likes?

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming

This is meaningless.

Head over to https://optimusfutures.isystems.com/ and you will see hundreds of systems with hypothetical track records, just like the one shown here. Without verifiable trading statements that these MTPredictor signals were actually traded, you cannot and I mean cannot consider this to be any more relevant than a made up Excel spreadsheet.

So Dinas unless you want to prove otherwise (or anybody at MTPredictor for that matter) – I will take your post and link as being irrelevant.

Almost spring here
Guest
Almost spring here

I think your responses are irrelevant. It shows that you haven’t used the system, haven’t listen to the setup rules and haven’t got a clue what MTP is all about. You should stop writing about things you don’t know nothing about.

Winter Is Coming
Guest
Winter Is Coming
What difference does it make if I haven’t used the software? What difference does it make if I don’t know the setup rules? Not a single trader, including (MTPredictor themselves) can verify that knowing the software and knowing the setup rules makes MTPredictor profitable. So what difference does it make again? If you are saying that knowing the software inside and out makes MTPredictor profitable, prove it – because there are traders on here that have stated it isn’t profitable. So it must be because they are poor traders, correct? Or they don’t know how to use the software? You… Read more »
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